June 10, 2004
TRUTH
OK, just to clear something up, even though it's 0100 and I really shouldn't be tackling this subject at such an hour: it seems I pissed some people off when I wrote about
Objective Truth. Believe you me when I say that I do think that there is truth out there. I think there's a right and wrong, and I just recently wrote a post about
thinking in black and white. I haven't changed my mind in one week. I think there's real true-ness, as in facts that can be proven, but I don't think there's "Objective Truth", as in something that everyone accepts as truth.
Was Reagan a national hero who deserves to be on the $10 bill or is it that "the world will be a better place without that fascist f*cker's presence to soil it"? How can those two things be so polar? Isn't there Objective Truth out there? I don't think most people are capable of it. If we were capable of Objective Truth, then we wouldn't have such a shocking juxtaposition of opinions on Reagan.
So, to try to better explain what I meant, I do think that there are facts out there, but I don't think that most people are able to look past their bias to see them. So we end up with two truths.
For real, it's way too late to be writing this.
Posted by: Sarah at
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Lech Walesa shares his viewpoint at http://www.opinionjournal.com/editorial/feature.html?id=110005204
This kinda ties to the cowboy theme we had going a while back.
Posted by: homebru at June 11, 2004 03:35 PM (KDnWK)
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You can call it truth, bias or "spin". To bring the subject down to a simplistic view, try this...The glass is half empty. No, the glass is half full. Who is right? They both are, technically. But that's just spin. FWIW, I believe the glass is half full. And I believe the LLL's will ALWAYS believe the glass is half empty.
Posted by: Bic at June 13, 2004 02:25 AM (ZtWGh)
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Good point, Bic. Thanks.
Posted by: Sarah at June 13, 2004 05:43 AM (mPqzc)
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Unbelievable.
You have apparently never been introduced to the concept of science. Here, let me offer you a few objective truths. The Earth is round. The Sun is hot. Falling off a 40' height will cause damage. Foolish and self-absorbed contemplations of one's navel will result in excessive and unwonted admiration of one's role in the universe.
See - that wasn't so terribly difficult was it?
Posted by: GWPDA at June 13, 2004 11:33 AM (kpVNh)
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Who are you?
Are you a member of the Human Race?
Roadkill perhaps?
Posted by: Cloned Poster at June 13, 2004 11:52 AM (17uvR)
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Isiah Berlin had a clue.
In one of his most famous essays, 'The Hedgehog and The Fox' (1953), Berlin focused on the tension between monist and pluralist visions of the world and history, and drew the line between different authors and philosophers. As the Greek poet Archilochus said: "The fox knows many things, but the hedgehog knows one big thing." The Hedgehog needs only one principle, that directs its life. Typical examples are Plato, Dante, Pascal, Nietzsche and Proust. The Fox, pluralist, travels many roads, according to the idea that there can be different, equally valid but mutually incompatible concepts of how to live. The roads do not have much connection, as is seen in the works of Aristotle, Montaigne, Shakespeare, Moliére, Goethe and Balzac. In Tolstoy, whose view of history inspired Berlin to write the essay, he saw a fox who believed in being a hedgehog. Berlin's central dichotomy of monists and pluralists and his interest in such Counter-Enlightenment figures as Vico, was later interpreted as an attack on the values of Enlightenment. He was also accused of ultra-individualism.
More here
Posted by: walter karp at June 13, 2004 12:05 PM (LLuT6)
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Really, it is disturbing to see that someone with such a questionable world view is teaching (Social Studies?) Clear evidence that the battlegound for the enlightenment of our country starts with the trenches of K-12.
Note to the "half-full" "half-empty" guy. If you think that the world is a better place than it was in the Clinton administration--you might want to check yourself. The reasons why folks (LLL's? whatever that means) are questioning this administration are quite valid, and I challenge you to jump out of your box for a little fact-finding mission. (Note that "box" rhymes with "Fox")
Posted by: tenmilekyle at June 13, 2004 12:07 PM (3UjtD)
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Actually, the Clinton Administration shows that the less the government does, the better.
As an engineer, I believe the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.
Posted by: Mike at June 13, 2004 01:43 PM (+K53a)
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"Actually, the Clinton Administration shows that the less the government does, the better.
As an engineer, I believe the glass is twice as big as it needs to be."
I'm not sure if I follow what you are trying to say on the first bit there, but I appreciate the humor in the second bit :-)
Now get back to work on the Hydrogen Economy!
Posted by: tenmilekyle at June 13, 2004 02:09 PM (3UjtD)
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Well, from a scientific method standpoint, there are such things as facts. Some of the things that make facts facts are objective measurements, repeatability, and widely-agreed on definitions. Measuring a president's "greatness" doesn't really fit any of those.
Now, of course, we could develop some sort of value function that could rate the presidents, but, the development of that measure would be fraught with bias. (How do we measure greatness? Inverse of the likelihood that a senior administration official was indicted? Popularity at end of office? Average popularity across time in office?) To claim, objectively, that President X is the best President of all time (or, similiarly, that these 5 Presidents are the best of all time) we'd have to come to some agreement on how to rank them - and this isn't a question of facts or biases but one that is fundamentally one of opinion. We may weigh certain facts more heavily than other people (and our "facts" may be wrong - my grandmother thought of Bill Clinton as a bad person because he fled the US for Canada to evade the draft - despite the fact that he was happily practicing law in Arkansas well before Carter issued his pardon), but that doesn't make our opinion more valid than other people's.
In complex decison making events, it's often difficult for even a single decision-maker to develop a relative worth measure that consistently works (delivers the same answer) across time. Example: there may very well be a "best car" for you to own, and under "best car" we can include long-term effects like maintenance, reliabililty, etc., as well as subjective measurements ("I like that color") but think of how few people treat decisions like that in that way, and of those who do, they very often end up with inconsistent answers.
There's an entire field of Decision Analysis which is based on getting an individual or organization to map out their preferences in order to objectively match their preferences to a preferred course of action. It works on its practitioners and participants ability to answer questions on their preferences, and forces them to consider what is objective knowledge and what it subjective. I recommend you look into it.
Posted by: Darkwater at June 13, 2004 07:22 PM (tXhUe)
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Hi there Darkwater.
You have given me what my good friend Denny would call a "Tony Jenson" answer (save yourself the google search, he's just a co-worker), which amounts to something along the line of:
Q: What time is it?
A: Looks like rain tonight.
Now, I'll grant you that you seem like a rather smart cookie, and I must admit that I only skimmed over most of your jargon. Next time train your big ol' brain on the question at hand instead of constructing a question that you can string the most five dollar words together in answer to.
Enough preaching, I don't mean to be snarky, I just hate this tactic of diversion.
FYI, I was talking about just one comprison: the condition of America now -vs- its condition during the Clinton administration. I was not interested in rating the presidents as much as how life is/was under them. Issues like the swing of our economy (we were in a recession before 9/11 BTW)/Jobs/Personal Freedoms/the Deficit. I'm also talking about things like the negative (evil IMHO) face that this administration has put on America. The crass motives behind the invasion of Iraq and the price that our boys are paying in unarmored humvees, eating rotted KB&R food, asking for batteries from home in their care packages. (This seems to be basically a military forum, I'm sure its readers will not deny that these issues exist) I'm talking about the hubris that has put soldiers in harms way without adequate preparation or an exit plan for winning the peace. The breathtakingly poor character of our president and how it affects our relationship with our government (read polarizing). I will submit that the character issue was certainly a disappointment with Clinton--but I find a stained dress to be less of an issue than the issues we face today.
My thought is, along with many other people, that history will judge this administration very harshly. Call me vindictive, but I want that report card to come out before these folks can do any MORE damage.
Sarah, let me also offer an apology for the poor behavior of the posters (though I admit I did snark you once--but it was in jest an without mean any slur). I hope that you can salvage something positive from this experience.
Posted by: tenmilekyle at June 13, 2004 08:34 PM (3UjtD)
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I feel sort of bad for Sarah. She is being nesieged by people that want to challenege her logic and her ideology. Why can't people just accept that this is what Sarah thinks and that they should allow her to wallow in her own opinions?
Sarah represents the opinons of a whole lot of wingers out there that are teachers and doctors and engineers - who also might believe in Biblical creation. Here is South Carolina, my science teacher spoke of Evolution as though it was some sort of liberal trick - I bashed my head in every day arguing with the guy and all I got was a C out of it. Some people are simply too fargone to recover. They know what they want to know and cannot see beyond that.
You can call that stupidity, but how can someone that is sure of their own validity even attempt to challenge their perceptions. Perceptions come first, facts must be wrong or biased or irrellevant if they do not agree with the facts.
Republicans cannot be argued with any more than Creationists or hyper environmentalists. Hell, most people think like this - our society is based on it.
Posted by: Scott Fanetti at June 13, 2004 09:05 PM (5Cu8X)
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Just what this world needs ... another clueless half wit American.
Posted by: BenS at June 13, 2004 10:17 PM (fFeny)
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It won't let me comment on the other post, about the LA Times poll. About that, I just wanted to say:
1) Jeez people are awfully mean.
2) To all those people who are like "Get a book on statistics"... well, duh, of course a book BY A STATISTICIAN is going to SUPPORT THE IDEA OF SAMPLING, duh. How about, um, an unbiased book?
3) I have read 1000's of polls but I have NEVER been polled, ever. I have zero confidence that any poll reflects how I feel or really how anybody feels, except those few people that were in the poll.
4) OK some guy wrote "...A back of the envelope way to get margins of error is to take the reciprocal of square root of the number polled and multiply it by 100 to get percentage. Therefore 100/sqrt(1230) = 2.85, which is close to the 3% margin quoted in the article."
PUHLEEEEZE! That is a perfect example of basically elitist bias. I am supposed to understand this? It means nothing to me. Blah blah blah squareroot blah blah... that is just a bunch of nothing. Really people are not interested in this kind of blather.
Posted by: a supporter at June 14, 2004 03:36 AM (fADbz)
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Supporter:
With friends like you, Sarah doesn't need enemies. Are you a troll ? I mean, how much more perfectly could you illustrate the contentions of some here that righties are willfully ignorant. I mean, you essentially come out and say, "I don't believe that crap, and I get bored by anyone trying to explain why I should believe it". Why bother to read posts like this if you already know what you're going to believe ? If you think using math to reason about the world is an example of "basically elitist bias", I shudder for you .
Posted by: boonie at June 14, 2004 05:09 PM (Q6pEg)
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Dont forget folks for all your worrying is in vain, America will one day cease to exist or at least whatever model of society you think of as America will vanish...its this thought that keeps us europeans sanguin on the whole sorry mess that is the United States.
Posted by: Hank at July 31, 2004 09:38 PM (ostvM)
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This surely will eat a sandwich with the payroll advance.
Posted by: payday loan online at January 13, 2005 12:37 AM (L6SNZ)
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Posted by: rehearsals at August 20, 2005 02:37 PM (uU0zn)
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http://platvisa.acholipeace.org/dtjibr/ gentilitywelcomingwhereupon
Posted by: poker at September 01, 2005 08:43 PM (DcMsf)
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FORTUYN
I'm probably the only person who's thinking about Pim Fortuyn today, but something in
Between War and Peace got me thinking. In 2002 my Swedish teacher was from the Netherlands, so when Fortuyn was killed it actually registered with me. I didn't follow it closely (this was back when I was fingers-in-ears), but I at least knew the basics of Fortuyn's controversial politics. Today I started trying to find out more about him and what happened. I read lots of stuff on this
Pim Fortuyn Forum and also read that -- surprise, surprise -- Van der Graaf
killed him "for the sake of The Netherlands' Muslim population". It's no lie that everywhere in the world that there's conflict, Muslims are somehow involved.
Posted by: Sarah at
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I'd take this a step further: "wherever in the world that there's conflict (sic)," racists are involved.
Posted by: Alex at June 13, 2004 12:18 PM (SvvYR)
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Yesterday at the movie theater a young muslim women wearing on of her stupid shawls cut in front me in line. I kicked her in the back and beat her until she bled.
Then when her husband tried to help her I pulled out my knife and I stabbed him. I didn't get to see the movie as I had to run away but at least I can assert that you are correct that "everywhere" in the world there is conflict it involves muslims.
(jesus Christ you are stupid.)
Posted by: filchyboy at June 13, 2004 12:41 PM (3soAl)
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Gee, thank you so much for explaining things so clearly. Until now I couldn't figure out the cause of the troubles between Catholics and Protestants in Northern Ireland, but after reading your insight I realize that it is all the fault of Muslims.
"It's no lie that everywhere in the world that there's conflict, Muslims are somehow involved."
Such a generalized statement is remarkably similar to what Hitler would say:
"It's no lie that everywhere in the world that there's problems, Jews are somehow involved."
Posted by: Kevin at June 13, 2004 01:05 PM (AaBEz)
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Wow, such an amazing insight!
So the conflict in Northern Ireland--that was caused by Muslims trying to impose shariah in Belfast!
The ETA in Spain are angry because the government won't let their women wear hijab!
The FARC in Colombia are fighting to establish a fundamentalist state!
The Bosnian Muslims were the aggressors against poor, defenseless Slobodan Milosevic!
Unbelievable.
If you are, in fact, a teacher, and you are spreading such propagandist lies to your students, you are no worse than one of my junior high-school English teachers, who stated in class that "all Moslems are gun-toting terrorists who worship Aaala."
Throwing around generalities which have no real basis in fact to impressionable minds is one of the reasons why there is so much conflict and violence in the world today. As a teacher, I would have thought that you would be among the first to realize this--not be someone responsible for the dissemination of such vitriol.
The key to peace is understanding one another's differences, accepting them, and learning to live with them.
I hope that you represent an outlier in the ranks of American educators today. I fear for the future of America's youth if you are not.
Posted by: Won't suffer fools at June 13, 2004 01:52 PM (gUA7O)
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"It's no lie that everywhere in the world that there's conflict, Muslims are somehow involved."?????? What the??? What's that supposed to mean? What about....oh forget it, if I have to give you counterexamples, it's a waste of time. I thought some of the earlier posters were a little harsh condemning you, but this statement just sends me. And you teach? With this level of knowledge, you teach?
It's no lie that everywhere in the world that there's ignorance, ignorant teachers are somehow involved.
Posted by: Coriolanus at June 13, 2004 03:43 PM (KZeI/)
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"Sarah" (ho ho ho), under that curly wig you're really a fat smartarse dude jerking our chains by doing an Onionesque parody, right? I could almost believe an ignorant yet opinionated fool could write this post, but put that together your hilarious one about stats, and your mention of your "students" and it's clear to me this is a Jean Teasdale kind of joke.
Posted by: MrMOB at June 13, 2004 03:58 PM (+EUV1)
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Thank you, Sarah, for being a walking, breathing stereotype. I always love when all my worst assumptions of the moral corruption of conservatives is validated.
My god, you are heinous.
Posted by: Patriot at June 13, 2004 04:44 PM (3oc7t)
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For the US counterpart to Pim Fortuyn see the Aryan Nation or your local skin head group. I'm sure you'd be welcomed with open arms. Seeing, that you are very ignorant and unable to deal with simple math.
Posted by: andrew r at June 13, 2004 05:45 PM (3E2MO)
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Northern Ireland: All the Muslim's fault.
(Dammit, if only Thatcher knew!)
Posted by: Bill O'Really at June 13, 2004 06:46 PM (tXhUe)
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It's no lie that everywhere in the world that there's conflict, Muslims are somehow involved.
I'd call you a moron but that would be an understatement. I'm sure Fat Andy is proud of you, since you list his blog as an inspiration.
And your comments on polling were hysterical, really.
Posted by: Clif at June 13, 2004 07:58 PM (PwiTq)
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Sarah, you are one scary person. Unfortunately, your style of thinking (ie. racist), permeates the Right.
The greatest tragedies of the 20th century were perpetuated by non-Muslims. While few cultures or religions can claim to be free of violent dogmatic aspects, Christianity has certainly had the fire power to do the most damage.
Posted by: Gpilot at June 14, 2004 11:17 AM (lKUxU)
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Ok, as a Dutch person living in the UK I feel I have to comment. First of all the guy who killed Pim Fortuyn was an econut, so if you want to blame a group for it (not that I think you should) you are better of blaming Greenpeace or someting
Secondly, Pim Fortuyn was actually a very interesting figure. As you may or may not know, he was gay, and the Netherlands are far, far more tolerant of homosexuals than the US (or the UK for that matter). The problem he had with Muslims was with their intolerant outlook. He believed that in accomodating their religion into Dutch culture, homosexuals would lose their rights. Now, I do not agree with him, but I do think he had a valid point: how to maintain a tolerant society when a segment of society is not tolerant? And quite apropos the current situation in the US as well
I do think it is quite funny that you seem to admire him, because I think you would have found his 'lifestyle' abhorrent.
Posted by: Frank at June 14, 2004 01:15 PM (7YyB7)
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I've been reading an amazing book written a few years ago about our troublesome friends from the middle east. Here's a short passage. It's worth reading, I think you'll find it quite educational:
"...if the Arabic people's instinct of self-preservation is not smaller but larger than that of other peoples, if his intellectual faculties can easily arouse the impression that they are equal to the intellectual gifts of other races, he lacks completely the most essential requirement for a cultured people, the idealistic attitude.
In the Arabic people the will to self-sacrifice does not go beyond the individual's naked instinct of self-preservation. Their apparently great sense of solidarity is based on the very primitive herd instinct that is seen in many other living creatures in this world. It is a noteworthy fact that the herd instinct leads to mutual support only as long as a common danger makes this seem useful or inevitable. The same pack of wolves which has just fallen on its prey together disintegrates when hunger abates into its individual beasts. The same is true of horses which try to defend themselves against an assailant in a body, but scatter again as soon as the danger is past.
It is similar with the Arab. His sense of sacrifice is only apparent. It exists only as long as the existence of the individual makes it absolutely necessary. However, as soon as the common enemy is conquered, the danger threatening all averted and the booty hidden, the apparent harmony of the Arabs among themselves ceases, again making way for their old causal tendencies. The Arab is only united when a common danger forces him to be or a common booty entices him; if these two grounds are lacking, the qualities of the crassest egoism come into their own, and in the twinkling of an eye the united people turns into a horde of rats, fighting bloodily among themselves.
If the Arabs were alone in this world, they would stifle in filth and offal; they would try to get ahead of one another in hate-filled struggle and exterminate one another, in so far as the absolute absence of all sense of self-sacrifice, expressing itself in their cowardice, did not turn battle into comedy here too."
Of course, I should mention that the above passage is from Mein Kampff, written by a German scholar by the name of A. Hitler. All I had to do was swap "Jew" for "Arab".
Pretty cool, huh?
Fuckin' Ragheads. Let's just gas 'em all, eh Fraulein?
Posted by: a conservative student of history at June 15, 2004 04:58 PM (sj6jn)
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To set the record straight: Van der Graaf did not kill "for the sake of The Netherlands' Muslim population." His motif was, according to the court, that he viewed Fortuyn "as a growing menace for the vulnerable groups in society". Vulnerable groups being a Dutch eufemism for the poor, they not only consist of the recent Muslim immigrants, but also of other groups like the pensioners, the long-term ill and the handicapped.
Posted by: Balko at June 16, 2004 09:02 PM (C0qxt)
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Sarah, I discovered your blog only a few days ago, and have been enjoying it. I was a bit surprised by how much I agreed with you, and where I disagree I am usually still glad for the opinion. But, damn it, to say that "It's no lie that everywhere in the world that there's conflict, Muslims are somehow involved" is so beneath your intellect. I'm undyingly proud to be an American, but I don't wonder that people burn our flag if that is the kind of sentiment they see as representative of our nation. As an American abroad, and an Army wife no less, you should act as a representative of what is best and most admirable about our country, it's history and ideals. I'm really disappointed.
Posted by: Disappointed admirer at February 07, 2005 11:17 AM (z1qWa)
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June 09, 2004
POLLINATION
The other day on the phone, my husband told me about the many young Iraqi boys who have learned English over the past year by hanging around Soldier checkpoints. He said they're there every day and that their English is really quite good, despite never having had formal instruction. However, they're also picking up the foul language that comes with soldiering, so it's not uncommon to hear a string of swear words or a horrifying insult come out of these teens. "Now there's your
cultural cross-pollination," my husband quipped.
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I wonder how well the soldiers have learned to cuss in Arabic as a result of this cultural exchange.
Posted by: Glenmore at June 09, 2004 08:30 PM (ES3Ub)
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GI's have been giving (and taking) language lessons from LNs since before the Romans.
Remember Hawkeye teaching the Koreans "Frank Burns eats worms" and "You said it ferret face"?
Posted by: homebru at June 11, 2004 03:30 PM (KDnWK)
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Yes, thanks to the American occupation of Iraq, young Iraqi boys can proudly proclaim:
"Get out of the fucking car you towel headed bastard!"
Posted by: Scott Fanetti at June 13, 2004 09:08 PM (5Cu8X)
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DEMARCATION
One of the hardest parts of being informed about current events and politics is constantly being aware that there is no such thing as Objective Truth out there. Things that I consider Conspiracy Theory are someone else's Obvious Facts. Things I think are Indisputable are labeled Lies by others. One man's Hero is another man's Hitler. I guess I shouldn't have been shocked then to find that I could read numerous blog posts on all my daily reads praising and honoring President Reagan, but that there were still
many posts out there that demonize and disrespect our former president. And that the lines are cleanly drawn between Left and Right. It's no big surprise that the names on that list of bloggers who bash Reagan include Ted Rall and Daily Kos. The demarcation zone is always right where I expected it to be. It's tedious, really, to know that you're always stuck preaching to the choir, that I'm posting the same thing now that I said
back in February. Will we ever reach a point where we understand each other?
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Will we ever reach a point where we understand each other?
Only when people learn to think for themselves, and quit accepting opinion as fact. Just because someone you like or respect says something doesn't make it true.
Posted by: Mike at June 09, 2004 05:48 PM (+K53a)
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How fun. This is something I've been thinking about all week. I'm reading "Rise to Globalism" about american foreign policy from WWII to at least the 90s and have been really surprised at some of it. Bush has nothing on Kennedy and Nixon and Kissinger in manipulating the public and other things.
But yeah, if we can't agree on what actually happened in history, much less why it happened, how do we ever agree on anything?
Posted by: Beth at June 09, 2004 10:47 PM (ubl7h)
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I posted about the hatred about Reagan. When they first announced he was near death, but not dead, the folks at Democratic Underground said thinks like "I'll piss on his grave".
What punks.
Posted by: Tom at June 10, 2004 09:27 AM (0Bcwa)
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The problem, Sarah, is there really IS "objective truth"; however, in our new progressive, post-modern society, objective truth has been drowned out by existentialists who, when challenged on their idealogies, stick their fingers in their ears, and shout, "I'm not listening, la-la-la-la-la-, ..." &c, &c, &c, ad nauseam.
There are those who do, of course espouse the concept of objective truth: some of whom we are now in a life-or-death struggle with; but note how they go about spreading their idealogy, their understanding of objective truth. They espouse that theirs is the only truth. They "evangelize" (if I may be so bold as to use that word) by driving 757s into 110-storey buildings. Their converts are cowed into a semblance of belief (a very close friend of mine--who is on his own quest to spread his own concept of Truth--has lived in Bosnia for over a decade; Bosnians, he has learned, followed Islam out of convenience, not out of conviction or fear. Essentially, the Ottoman Empire's er, "representatives", suggested that if they will allow mosques to be built, and if they at least make a point of visiting on a regular basis, the boys from Ottoman-land will keep those infidel Orthodox folks (Serbs) and infidel Catholic folks (Croats) out of their land, where they often met to carry on their centuries-old feud), or are either enslaved or removed from the equation. This I know you painfully understand, since your hero husband is there in the thick of things (and I, as well as all Americans owe him--and you, as well--an enormous debt of gratitude).
But another group asserts that theirs is the only "true Truth", if I may coin that phrase. The primary difference between how they live out their truth is by just telling others of their truth. They also do such things as build hospitals, care for elderly, effect social change where needed (the abolition movements both here in the United States and in Great Britain come to mind), step in when necessary to help those in need (though not nearly as devoutly or as effectively as in the past--to their (and my) shame)--I think of Amy Carmichael, who, at the turn of the last century, discovered that her calling was to purchase, if necessary, those TODDLER girls (and later, when conditions enabled her) those TODDLER boys who were destined to be "married to the gods" and be groomed for erotic plays, respectively.
Of course, that same genre of people settled in what they had first hoped was Jamestown (turns out they were a few hundred miles to the north) in 1620. Now they and their offspring are reviled and dismissed as being irrelevant: Their ideas, their world view, their foundational beliefs which were made manifest in not only their writings, but in the kind of society and government they wrought, are now considered passe. They don't understand, we are told; they weren't as learned as we. Kind of like President Reagan--or so I learned listening to this morning's "Morning Edition" on the local NPR affiliate.
It just seems to me that the Judeo-Christian understanding of Truth has done a rather better job of creating a civil society of people who CHOOSE to be governed in a certain manner by whomever THEY choose, than any other form of keeping the homo sapien race from self-destructing.
By the way--your husband? He's my hero too, and I remember him in my prayers regularly. May Divine Providence keep him and all those who have picked up the baton to run the race in these dangerous times safe. And thank YOU for lending him to us, your fellow citizens.
Jim
Posted by: Jim Shawley at June 10, 2004 05:17 PM (CnYsu)
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Does Objective Truth exist? If it did we might not even recognize it as such. It would just look like any other dubious theory. It is more usefull to think of truth in terms of survival of the fittest. The fittest ideas about any phenonmenon survive in their environment. If the environment is an authoritarian church-state, like Europe was in Iran, is then the state will decide which ideas survive. If the environment is community of free-thinking, open-minded people who are ready to follow the facts to where they lead rather than trying to manipulate the facts to fit their agenda, then you have Science.
Posted by: tk at June 13, 2004 01:49 PM (s4w1s)
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Sorry, should have previewed that, lets try again.
Does Objective Truth exist? If it did we might not even recognize it as such. It would just look like any other dubious theory. It is more usefull to think of truth in terms of survival of the fittest. The fittest ideas about any phenonmenon survive in their environment. If the environment is an authoritarian church-state, like Europe was and Iran is, then the state will decide which ideas survive. If the environment is community of free-thinking, open-minded people who are ready to follow the facts to where they lead rather than trying to manipulate the facts to fit their agenda, then you have Science.
Posted by: tk at June 13, 2004 01:52 PM (s4w1s)
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I love it when Christian evangelicals talk abou their obvious objectivity then make slurs about a religion different from their own. The people that piloted those planes into the World Trade Center were not typical Muslims - mass murder is not a central component to Islam. If one's religion could be judged by the actions of the most self-righteous of its faithful, then the Christians are no better than the Muslims. How many Native Americans - and people from all over the world - were conquered, turned into slaves and force fed Christianity? How many millions of Muslims died in the crusades? How many witches and heretics were burned at the inquisitor's stake?
The reality is, a lot of those terroristic Muslims are not interested in destroying Americans because they hate our "freedom" as the president aaserts. A lot of them hate us because the rich guys that run our country have repeatedly bombed their families, killed their friends, supported their tyrants, and relegated them to lives of misery to preserve our access to cheap resources.
There is objective truth. Everything is not simply a matter of opinion or "librul bias". The problem is that you guys rarely read enough about history and foreign affairs to be able to see something that is objectively true. If a situation does not coorespond with your set of beliefs, you simply ignore the conflicting information.
The Republican party platform is built on ignoring inconvenient facts.
Posted by: Scott Fanetti at June 13, 2004 09:26 PM (5Cu8X)
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MOURNING
I just found out that I work in one of the non-essential Federal offices covered under
President Bush's memo for the National Day of Mourning in honor of President Reagan. That means I get Friday off of work. To be honest, I feel rather guilty about enjoying a vacation day a week after a President died. I feel like I should find something meaningful to do Friday to show my respect instead of just hanging around the house and knitting. I'll have to come up with something fitting.
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1
I've been ordered to attend services at the chapel with 18 pews.
Posted by: Mike at June 09, 2004 10:33 AM (cFRpq)
2
You could always knit something patriotic.
Hell, you could just do whatever makes you happy.
Don't you think Reagan would have approved of that?
Posted by: Sigivald at June 09, 2004 04:21 PM (4JnZM)
3
I agree with Sigivald -- President Reagan would have wanted you to enjoy your free time and appreciate your liberty to do as you please.
Posted by: david at June 10, 2004 10:22 AM (1+76a)
4
Write your husband a letter... perhaps include a postcard or two if he has a buddy who doesn't get much mail.
Me.. the state considers me expen..err essential
Posted by: Lconley at June 11, 2004 06:11 PM (2cE9S)
5
I hope you used your time constructively . . . maybe you could have read a book on statistics.
Posted by: Tim at June 13, 2004 01:25 PM (7xctT)
6
Do you know anyone with hostages? You could trade arms for the hostages. Or perhaps you could lay a wreath on the grave of a dead Nazi.
Posted by: Dan at June 13, 2004 03:11 PM (9ovRf)
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CUCKOO
As my neighbor said the other day, "There's only one thing worse than a cuckoo clock: a real cuckoo." We have one; he lives in our neighborhood and starts singing when the sun comes up. Unfortuately, at this time of year that's at about 0530. And a clock only cuckoos twelve times...
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You teach? A cuckoo clock makes noise 24 times a day - one for each hour! Or does your day only consist of 12 hours?
Posted by: Mike at June 13, 2004 01:07 PM (ysKeb)
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June 08, 2004
PARALLEL
I got home and got my slip of paper with the blog idea. It wasn't much after all; I just thought of a parallel last night. I watched
The Longest Day on Sunday because, well, that's the least I can do. I can't be sure what was hard fact and what was "dramatic effect", but the Germans in the movie kept insisting that the invasion would never be at Normandy and it would never be at night or in the rain. They insisted that the Americans were predictable and that invading Normandy was illogical. It reminded me of the Shock and Awe Campaign, where everyone insisted that Iraq would start with heavy aerial bombing and then ground troops would move in much later. The whole world was shocked and awed when the Marines rolled in earlier than expected.
Pundits all over like to predict what our military will do and pronounce certain events as catastrophic or quagmirish before they have all the pieces of the puzzle. I'm sure that there are things that the military could work on, but I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt that they often are planning moves we could never predict.
That's what makes them the best, I guess.
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1
Everyone on television and in the news wants to predict rather than report. And they can't understand why the President or our military leaders won't tell them everything. What we don't know is precisely what the leaders are using to make decisions. The most we can possibly hope for is to guess. And journalists are pretty poor at that because they have no shared experience to go by.
Posted by: Mike at June 08, 2004 04:57 PM (cFRpq)
2
What I'd love to see the media say:
"Well, we were wrong about how the Iraq war would happen, we totally screwed up on our projections that the battle for Baghdad would lead to huge loss of life, and we also blew it with the whole "Afghanistan has never been successfully invaded" thing... but (and you can trust us- look at our track record) here's what's going to happen in Iraq, next..."
Posted by: Jack Grey at June 09, 2004 10:42 AM (3nn57)
3
In the Gulf War, we fooled them too. Remember they thought the Marines would launch an amphibious attack into Kuwait. Instead we gave them the famous "left hook."
Posted by: annika at June 09, 2004 03:17 PM (zAOEU)
4
Based on a book by Cornelius Ryan, The Longest Day is pretty true to its source, and the Cornelius Ryan book is extremely well sourced and accurate (as is his other book, A Bridge Too Far).
As I recall very little strays from the book, and hence from the history. Though at the time the movie was made, since few movie critics knew anything about the war and had never bothered with Ryan's book, called some of it pure fantasy. Funny thing though, it was the most unbelievable scenes that actually happened. Truth stranger than.....
Kal
Oh, HIYA,
Posted by: Kalroy at June 14, 2004 01:57 PM (l10gw)
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WORKING
I thought I'd try to simulate my husband's workweek by logging 56 work hours this week, 25 of which fall on Monday and Tuesday. I start teaching again tonight, and so I'm swamped.
I had a blog idea last night too, and I wrote it on a notepad by my bed. I'll be darned if I can't remember at all what it was...
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You are too young to be suffering with sometimerz disease. That's for us old folk.
Posted by: Mike at June 08, 2004 07:39 AM (cFRpq)
2
Mike,
What's "sometimerz disease"?
Whatever it is, Sarah, don't infect yourself with it.
And if you can't blog much (or at all later) this week, I'll understand. Your jobs always come first.
But do cut down if you can. Self-torture is not a virtue. Blue 6 knows you're thinking of him. You don't have to be like him.
Posted by: Amritas at June 08, 2004 09:29 AM (bDJgY)
3
... well, you know what I meant by that last line, which wasn't "You should be his negative image Orange -6 and counter his every virtue with a vice."
What I was trying to get at was this: He knows you feel for him; you don't have to empathize with him by putting yourself through 56 hours.
Posted by: Amritas at June 08, 2004 09:32 AM (bDJgY)
4
I'm afflicted with it...not quite Alzheimer's disease.
Posted by: Mike at June 08, 2004 02:13 PM (3b89y)
5
What's next, foregoing the fans and cranking up the heat until it's 110 degrees in your apartment?
Don't tire yourself out TOO much, it probably helps his morale that at least one of you has fun every once in a while. (And, to inject a ME MOMENT - what will I read with my coffee?) Hope you're blogging again soon.
Posted by: Oda Mae at June 08, 2004 04:33 PM (FImW9)
6
Oda Mae,
"What's next, foregoing the fans and cranking up the heat until it's 110 degrees in your apartment?"
Hah! The weather forecast lists lows in the 40s for your part of Germany this coming weekend. Perhaps an engineer can figure out a way to bridge the 70 degree gap. Paging Den Beste ...
Sarah,
Blue 6 is probably trying to figure out a way to emulate YOUR lifestyle.
Posted by: Amritas at June 09, 2004 04:28 AM (V1KL+)
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June 07, 2004
OIL
This is where I kinda want to do an I-told-you-so dance:
Although Iraq is a major petroleum producer, the country has little capacity to refine its own gasoline. So the U.S. government pays about $1.50 a gallon to buy fuel in neighboring countries and deliver it to Iraqi stations. A three-month supply costs American taxpayers more than $500 million, not including the cost of military escorts to fend off attacks by Iraqi insurgents.
It was never about oil for the USA. If I hear that again I'm gonna slug someone.
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If I tell you where my neighbor lives, can you slug her? I just heard that STUPID comment come out of her mouth earlier today.
Posted by: Erin at June 09, 2004 05:16 PM (0AR3P)
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It's all about the oil Sarah. Go ahead and slug me sweetheart.
Posted by: filchyboy at June 13, 2004 12:44 PM (3soAl)
3
Your comments are just wrong. Iraq has some of the largest untapped oil reserves in the world. This war wasn't about getting cheap gas now, silly, it was about ensuring that American companies have control over future oil reserves by setting up a trade friendly puppet government.
Do you question anything that the GOP tells you?
Posted by: ubu at June 13, 2004 01:45 PM (nGkTI)
4
Ridht, and not finding any WMDs proves that we didn't go to war to find WMDs. Same logic!
Posted by: Russ at June 13, 2004 01:59 PM (MU8Zb)
5
Goddamn, Sarah...you should have to have a license to be that stupid!
Posted by: Arnold Ziffel at June 13, 2004 05:10 PM (71IZj)
6
When Sarah sees a chess board and player 1 takes player 2's queen, she must think that the objective of the game was to take the queen.
How can she teach with such a poor awareness of reality?
Oil is the lifeblood of our economy. We have been sucking on the oil pipe for a long time and we spend a proportionately miniscule amount of money attempting to find less contentious sources of energy. There is also a finite amount of oil in the world - and we are now at peak production. The proces for oil will just keep getting higher - no matter what we do.
Our leaders had a choice. They could have moved us into a more efficient, less oil dependent economy after the oil crisis of the 70s - or they could follow the Reaganomic view that lead to our current Catch-22. The conquering of Iraq is simply another move in the chess board to keep us positioned to take control of the oil when China starts to fiend for it as badly as we do.
Thinking that oil was not the central drive for the war is like thinking that the purpose of a car engine is to turn the flywheel. It ignores everything else that is going on.
Posted by: Scott Fanetti at June 13, 2004 09:41 PM (5Cu8X)
7
Um.... nobody said the war was about gasoline. Just oil. You're obviously intelligent enought to realize the difference.
You do know, though, that we don't import gasoline here in the US? We import oil which we then refine into gasoline. Here. In the US. In large refineries typically located on the coast. There are bunches of them around Houston.
You understand, don't you, that the availibility of gasoline in Iraq has absolutely ZERO relation to whether or not we fought this war for oil? I'm not saying we did, mind you, just that you're terribly simpleminded if you believe that the lack of refining capacity in Iraq offers conclusive proof to the contrary...
Posted by: john at June 14, 2004 02:26 AM (bA3ne)
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Try being a tad more 'biased' towards the truth, clown. And if you're not too busy jerking whatever you perceive to be the truth around - read this.
"The U.S. should conduct an immediate policy review towards Iraq, including military, energy, economic and political/diplomatic assessments."
Its from the James A Baker Institute for Public Policy. From this paper published in *APRIL 2001*...(yeh - several months before 9/11)
http://www.rice.edu/energy/publications/docs/TaskForceReport_Final.pdf
Funny how the first option is a "military" assessment huh? Almost like saying 'nail the bastards'. But I'm sure you can bullshit your students somehow. Why not let them read this paper? In fact I *dare* you to so, and then present ANY other alternative for Americas invasion as an excuse. I suspect they'll laugh in your face. Do it. I DARE you. No guts, no glory hon. At least you'll be able to tell the smart students from the stupid ones. The smart ones will be laughing at you.
and P.S.: if I have to tell you why James Baker is relevant, you truly are clueless. Read the paper. Learn. Try and understand. And for heavens sake stop trying to pawn yourself off as a teacher. You spew endless garbage. Give it a rest. Or perhaps simply try giving 'the truth' a go. I doubt you will - it's too tough to understand.
It was about oil for the USA.
Now "Bring it on", you useless lump of ignorance.
I'm waiting...
Posted by: Chuck at June 14, 2004 03:23 AM (bEJDP)
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So, since we have to refine the oil and ship it back (due to the destruction of the refineries due to certain *unfortunate events* of the past several years), all of a sudden there's no oil motivator in toppling Saddam.
Mama mia.
That's a serious shortfall of logic there, lady.
Posted by: the big kahuna at June 14, 2004 10:02 AM (stMiV)
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Come on, Sarah. Think!! The war was not about getting refined gasoline... holy smokes, lady. It ALL has to be refined somewhere... but the war was not about capturing refineries. The war is about securing huge reserves of oil in the ground.
So slap me already, it won't change the reality on the ground.
Posted by: Gpilot at June 14, 2004 11:23 AM (lKUxU)
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Always with the violence. Sad.
So anyhoo, yes it *was* about the oil. It's just that your Rethuglican so-called 'oilmen' heros are so incompetent, they couldnÂ’t even produce oil when itÂ’s already done for them. ThatÂ’s why theyÂ’re so frigging obsessed with the Arctic NWR. They figure even fuckups like them can get oil out of the ground there.
Wanna bet they canÂ’t?
Posted by: GW at June 14, 2004 11:36 AM (0K5pN)
12
The war was about oil, at least for the French. $70 billion dollars worth of contracts for the government owned French oil companies. As to the alternative fuel claims, den Beste has pretty much shed light on that situation.
By the way folks these hybrid cars get worse gas milage than the old Yugo, and electric cars are pretty worthless for many if not most Americans. I don't see any that will let me drive the 20 hours home it takes, or the sixty minutes each way just to go shopping and still give me enough leeway to run around town. Not to mention their incredibly high cost for a working stiff such as myself.
Kal
Posted by: Kalroy at June 14, 2004 02:07 PM (l10gw)
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DEBATE
I have never read the Harry Potter books nor seen the movies, but I thought that this debate between
Mrs. du Toit and
James Hudnall over Harry Potter vs. The Lord of the Rings was very interesting.
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I found the Harry Potter books very enjoyable, quick reads. I would definately begin with book 1, and continue. Each book is better than the last and grows darker, more rich and enthralling.
I highly reccomend reading them.
Posted by: Tom at June 07, 2004 11:47 AM (0Bcwa)
2
A couple of years ago a young friend of mine found out that I had not read the Potter books. She bought me the whole set. We were leaving on one of our long trailer camping trips so I took them along, thinking well, okay. I really enjoyed them. A fast reader can read the first three easily at one a day, the first two could be read in one day if you wanted, they get progressively longer, darker and the last one makes you think much more about where we might be heading with this, but I won't tip my hand on my opinion.
These are a must read, try it, you'll like it.
Posted by: Ruth H at June 07, 2004 01:46 PM (fqxIZ)
3
Eh, Hudnall is right: LOTR was not written for children--Tolkien himself says this (although The Hobbit obviously was)--and Harry Potter, like almost all fantasy since him, is indeed derivative from Tokien. Yet you know quite well what a "fantasy nerd" I am from my site, though, and I can assure you that the Potter books are worth reading, especially the most recent works.
(Read the Earthsea cycle while you're at it! Heh.)
Posted by: Jeremiah at June 07, 2004 10:54 PM (pIuCN)
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I've read both sets, multiple times. Apples and Oranges. Both taste good, but are nothing alike.
Posted by: John at June 08, 2004 12:50 AM (crTpS)
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Your brother has read almost all of the Harry Potter books and your dad is reading them now. You should read the books before you see the movies.
Posted by: Nancy at June 08, 2004 12:59 AM (boDJK)
6
The Harry Potter books are good if unremarkable. The Lord of the Rings is remarkable, but certainly not to everyone's taste.
As for the movies - I've only seen the first two parts of LOTR and the second HP. LOTR is spectacular - not flawless, but an amazing piece of filmmaking. HP2 is spectacularly dull. It's very true to the original book, but they could have cut out an hour and improved it immensely.
Posted by: Pixy Misa at June 12, 2004 06:26 AM (+S1Ft)
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DEMONSTRATION
Why didn't
Erik and
Ray invite me? Now
that would be a reason to go back to France.
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June 06, 2004
HERO
Joe Beyrle is a
Hero. For both sides.
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SELF-CONSCIOUS
My husband told me that he reads my blog every day when he has internet access. To be honest, that makes me a little self-conscious, since my husband is the smartest man in the world. (Yes, I know I've said the same thing about Den Beste, but we'll just have to live with that paradox.) He also said that, because of the nature of his mission in Iraq, he sees many wedding parties every Thursday, so there's no way the bombing on the Syrian border, on a Tuesday, was a wedding. No way at all.
If you're reading this, Blue 6, know that I love you. Also know that I'm pretty sure you fell asleep while I was telling you a story on the phone, and you're in big trouble, mister. Ha. Get some much-deserved rest and dream of crab rangoon and Captain Morgan. Soldier safe...
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"we'll just have to live with that paradox."
No, let's not. Let's have the intellectual duel of the millennium when he comes back. The world's first pay-per-blog event. Watch as Pixy Misa's server burns out as thousands, nay, millions visit your site and watch Blue 6 and the Best compete for the title of पण्डितानां पण्डितः
paNDitaanaam paNDitaH "pundit of pundits."
Posted by: Amritas at June 06, 2004 06:26 AM (6UbaW)
2
BBC - May 24
A videotape has been broadcast which purports to show before-and-after footage of a wedding which Iraqis say the US bombed, killing about 40.
The film, released by a US news agency, combines a wedding home movie with video of the aftermath of the attack, which the US says targeted militants.
Some victims and survivors appear to be present in the wedding video.
The US has insisted it was responding to fire from foreign fighters near the border with Syria.
(There have been numerous reports it was a wedding part but the U.S. general doesn't want to admit it.)
The agency says the material broadcast was taken from several hours of footage, apparently filmed by a hired photographer who was among those killed.
The film shows gleaming pick-up trucks - some decorated with ribbons - speeding through the desert apparently en route to the wedding.
The celebrations themselves feature the traditional firing of salutes from guns and singing as well as men dancing to the music of a popular wedding singer.
The singer, Hussein Ali, was also killed, his grieving family told the BBC shortly after the attack.
Clearly visible on the wedding footage is a man playing electric organ who later appears to be among the corpses filmed by APTN.
AP says a reporter and a photographer who interviewed more than a dozen survivors a day after the bombing were able to identify many of them on the wedding party video.
It also says its footage of the aftermath shows remnants of musical instruments, pots and pans, and festive brightly coloured bedding.
'No evidence'
Survivors told journalists the wedding party had ended and guests were in bed when bombing began in the early hours of Wednesday.
Brig Gen Kimmitt suggested the site had been "somewhat of a dormitory" housing "military-aged" men.
Another US official told reporters on Monday that a wedding may have been held at the scene several hours before the air strike.
"We still don't believe that there was a wedding or a wedding party going on when we hit in the early hours of the morning," the unidentified official was quoted as saying by Reuters news agency.
"Could there have been some sort of celebration going on earlier? Certainly."
The BBC's Caroline Hawley reports from Iraq that, whatever the truth of why the US bombed Makr al-Deeb, it has been a public relations disaster.
Images of the funerals of the victims - and now the apparent video of the wedding itself - have been shown on television around the Arab world and beyond.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/3741223.stm
Say hello to that smart husband of yours, my nephew just got back from Iraq.
Gary
Posted by: Easter Lemming at June 13, 2004 10:31 PM (9UTEN)
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REAGAN
My husband's phone call woke me up this morning at 0600, and he told me that President Reagan had died while I was asleep. The fact is I am too young to appreciate President Reagan. I was twelve when he left office, which is far too immature to understand the impact of a president. However, I will spend some time to day getting to know him -- too little, too late -- through the different posts over at
Right Wing News today.
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JOE AND TOMMY
On Thursday I read an article in the Stars and Stripes that unfortunately was only in the dead-tree version of the paper. The article was called "German pupils have different view of war" and began:
Young Germans say they weren't taught that D-Day and the ensuing battles brought the defeat of Germany in World War II.
The reporter talked to students at the University of Heidelberg and found that many of them have never heard of Joe and Tommy:
Some of the Heidelberg students hadn't even heard of D-Day. "'Saving Private Ryan?'" said Anna Fischer, 19, of Karlsruhe. "Oh, that's D-Day."
Merde in France found that young people in France have also forgotten about Joe and Tommy:
Most French high school history textbooks are skimpy on the details of D-Day. They tend to focus closely on the challenges and dilemmas of living in occupied France. In a leading text, the Normandy invasion is described in just two paragraphs.
The young people in France and Germany have forgotten, but the Dissident Frogman has not. Last year he wrote Consecration:
To the eye, Bloody Omaha is just a sandy beach.
No white crosses, no huge memorial, no visible signs of those who sacrificed themselves and fought for freedom. No sign of those who fell for it.
Yet I remember "Joe" and "Tommy", heroes with no names but so many faces, who came here one day, fighters for a just cause, in a liberation army.
I was told about them, I read books about them, I saw pictures of them, and I watched interviews and movies. I heard their stories. The Joe and Tommy who got through this, told me about their brothers who didn't.
And they show me why they didn't fall in vain.
I have not forgotten either, though I know no one who was personally there. But I know who Joe and Tommy are, and I felt them with me when I took these pictures five years ago.
We must do what we can to keep Joe and Tommy alive. Read Consecration today. Visit Blackfive and get the history lesson that students in Germany and France are no longer receiving. Or simply take a moment to look at those white crosses -- and note the Star of David too -- and silently thank Joe and Tommy for what they did 60 years ago today.
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In my ingnorance I had no idea that the young people in France and Germany have not been taught about D-Day. That breaks my heart.
Posted by: Tammi at June 06, 2004 02:34 PM (uFT83)
2
Looks like Gerhard Schroeder doesn't get it either:
http://www.vodkapundit.com/archives/005928.php#005928
Posted by: beth at June 06, 2004 08:05 PM (eWK4H)
3
I don't know any French or any German who haven't been told about D-Day. Were the precise figures given in the Stars and Stripes? This information looks very strange to me. WW2 and DDay in particular are central points in history teaching programs in France and in Germany. Nobody underestimates nor forgets what happened
Posted by: emmanuel at July 01, 2004 12:27 PM (i24Ut)
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June 05, 2004
BRADBURY
Ray Bradbury is pissed that Michael Moore used
Fahrenheit 451 to name his movie.
Anders has translated the details.
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ETHICS
I hate the show
Crossfire. I hate the back and forth arguing and the stressful chaos. When I did invest the time to watch the full two hours of
Ethics in America:
Under Orders, Under Fire, I was glued to the computer. Here the panelists did not address each other, but only answered the hypothetical situations the moderator posed in a calm and deliberate fashion. They showed each other the highest respect and merely tried to explore their own ethics without belittling the ethics of others. I highly recommend watching the whole thing.
Thus by the time I got to the segment that was highlighted in Why We Hate the Media, I felt more pity for Peter Jennings and Mike Wallace than contempt. Here they were, surrounded by men in uniform who were trying to make difficult decisions about taking lives to protect others, and their jobs as reporters seemed so trivial in comparison. Their ethical systems seemed more trivial as well.
There was more nuance in Mike Wallace's ethics than was suggested in Why We Hate the Media. One exchange that really struck me, which I've transcribed here, after Wallace said that he would not warn the Americans that the enemy was going to ambush them, and would instead roll tape and "remain detached", to use Den Beste's words:
Lieutenant General Brent Scowcroft (R): What's it worth? It's worth thirty seconds on the evening news, as opposed to saving a platoon?
Mike Wallace: In other words what you're saying is that the reporter should say, "Hey, hold it, fellas. Americans, these guys are about to go after ya!" and you die? That's really what the question is here?
Moderator: And your answer is?
Mike Wallace: I don't know.
We ask our servicemembers to make these decisions everyday. No, I take that back; it's not even a decision. They do it no matter what. They, in putting on the uniform, have already made the decision that saving other Americans is indeed worth their own life. Standing up and yelling to save others is worth your own life. They don't think twice about it. Yet Mike Wallace, journalist and non-combatant, washes his hands of having to make that choice.
A few minutes later Major Stuart addresses this very paradox:
Major Robert C. Stuart, USMC: I think what we're asking the reporter on the scene to do is -- keeping in mind that that individual is not a combatant -- we expect our combatants to do in the normal course of their duties that which is heroic at all times. We are now all of a sudden charging the reporter with doing the heroic, when that is not...maybe for them it's super-heroic, to jump up and yell and scream and warn the Americans. I think that that's different however than that which we expect from ourselves while in uniform and in a combat situation.
Reporters are not expected to do the heroic, while our men and women in uniform do it every day. Why should we excuse "regular civilians" from doing things that will save the lives of others? Why is that a duty that only servicemembers must obey? Our Soldiers, Marines, Airmen, and Sailors should not be the only Americans who have to face the grim reality that the good of our society is more important than their own life.
Newt Gingrich, surprisingly enough, made an enlightening speech about the role of technology in the changing face of warfare. (And this was in 1987!) At the end, he summarized the whole dilemma between the military and the media:
I don't think we're good right now at deciding "who are we?" Are we Americans first? Are the South Kosanese [the fake ally] then ours? Is it as bad to see our friends and allies get killed as it is to see our own children get killed? What does it all mean? And I think we're right at the cutting edge in this discussion, with the technology and the reality. And all I would say is that the military, I think, has done a vastly better job of systematically thinking through the ethics of behavior in a violent environment than the journalists have.
I agree.
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The thing is, I think it shouldbe quite acceptable for journalists to declare themselves as neutral and objective. Of course, there's a bit of a downside to that, because then nobody in the military is then obligated to do a damn thing for them. Not a single press release, not a single squad to come running if they get into trouble, and if a cameraman is too close when the Mk82 hits, well, too damn bad.
Cake, eating it, and all that.
Posted by: Jason at June 05, 2004 02:47 PM (VdHJ9)
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I remember this same discussion year ago about the nature shows. The cameramen would film away as a lion took down an antelope because to do otherwise would destroy the balance of nature and interfere with the natural laws of the animal kingdom. But we're the same species, right? How can they be so detached? Maybe they really ARE half sewer rat.
Posted by: Oda Mae at June 05, 2004 08:09 PM (s6ldp)
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I recommend the entire series. Glad you took the time to watch. It has had a big impact on my view of warfare and, as a small part, the role our media play.
Posted by: Mike at June 05, 2004 08:37 PM (NZ4lg)
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We actually watched quite a bit of these videos during my junior and senior years of AFROTC. In fact, although I may be wrong, I'm pretty sure they are a required part of the curriculum for training new Air Force officers.
The series is really excellent, and ignited some great arguments in my class of 15-20 cadets.
Ah, the US military - seemingly one of the last bastions of ethics training.
Posted by: Sparky at June 07, 2004 12:43 AM (S3US+)
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Hmm.
So let's say some guy has got his foot trapped in a train's automatic doors and is about to be dragged off and probably killed as the train leaves the station.
Should the reporter alert the driver and save his life, or just write the story?
Posted by: Pixy Misa at June 12, 2004 06:38 AM (+S1Ft)
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How about the "When Animals Attack!" documentaries? Why didn't the cameraman warn the person he/she was about to be attacked by a wild animal and eaten alive?
Posted by: Madfish Willie at June 17, 2004 02:53 PM (eYi52)
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RAP
OK, even those of you who don't like rap have to go listen to this. It's footage from Michael Tucker's movie, in which
a Soldier raps about life in Iraq. It's a huge download, but I hope everyone can see it. That's pure talent.
(Thanks, Blackfive.)
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CUSSING
Best Friend
says my husband swears more than anyone he knows. He's obviously never met
these folks. They need a good ol'fashioned mouth washed out with soap...
Posted by: Sarah at
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1
Now watch as the "moral" equivalency crowd digs up warblogger posts and comments in search of profanity. "The poor language choices of TWO e-mail authors pale next to the Right's endless record of verbal abuse! Besides, four-letter words in the service of the Cause are OK. And many sites which avoid four-letter words use the most offensive slur of them all: 'terrorists.' Call them by their true name: freedom fighters! They are modern Minutemen! Ask Michael Moore!"
Posted by: Amritas at June 05, 2004 07:02 AM (iZzXN)
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DETACHED
Remember last week when I said I'd
strangle the journalist who values "the story" over someone's life? Well, according to Steve Sky and Charles Johnson, I just might get my
chance:
MOSUL, Iraq - Coalition soldiers questioned two news media cameramen and a reporter after a roadside bomb exploded near a Coalition convoy two kilometers north of Mosul June 3.
The media, who were at the scene prior to the attack, told soldiers at the scene they had received a tip to be at that location prior to the attack and they had witnessed the explosion.
One of my good friends is attached to 3-2 Infantry. That hits close to home. And those "detached" journalists were going to sit there with their cameras and watch American Soldiers get blown up.
What in the hell is wrong with these people?
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1
Don't strangle them. That's too kind. "Detachment" has another meaning.
Posted by: Amritas at June 05, 2004 07:05 AM (iZzXN)
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Oh, and if one does "detach" ... something, be sure to give the victim's fellow propagandists a tip. Let's see how "objective" they are then.
Posted by: Amritas at June 05, 2004 07:06 AM (iZzXN)
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This is unbelievable. What price "objectivity," "impartiality," or any other euphemism for this sort of callousness?
If this is the way "journalists" regard their occupational obligations and perquisites, they're more dangerous to our men at arms than the weapons of the enemy, and should be treated as such.
Posted by: Francis W. Porretto at June 05, 2004 07:18 AM (MzH7h)
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You've got to take the time to watch
these programs just to see Mike Wallace and Peter Jennings discuss just this topic.
Posted by: Mike at June 05, 2004 08:01 AM (NZ4lg)
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Mike,
As far as I can tell, journalists' conduct in wartime wasn't covered among the ten videos. Maybe they should produce a new volume. Nah, they'll just remake the My Lai volumes with Abu Ghraib.
Posted by: Amritas at June 05, 2004 09:41 AM (g8kbO)
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Rantingprofs covers this topic - including the Jennings/Rather response. I guess I love my country and those who protect us more than any story I could "cover." No way could I sit there and wait knowing American soldiers were about to be killed.
IT'S NOT AN ACADEMIC QUESTION ANYMORE
Posted by: Shannon at June 05, 2004 10:11 AM (Y6Pbo)
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Thanks, Shannon. I'll never be able to look at Jennings or Wallace the same way again. Not that I'll ever have to. I haven't watched broadcast network TV news in a long time, and I haven't seen FOX or any other cable news in months.
Here's another ethical dilemma: What if Wallace were covering the would-be-slaughter of NON-Americans? Would he intervene then? Is this purely a nationalistic issue? Is "objectivity" really a fig leaf for anti-Americanism?
Posted by: Amritas at June 05, 2004 11:45 AM (fNBXn)
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This is consistent with how the media views their job-- "Detached" means recording events but never altering them-- no matter how right or how easy it would be to do so....
Remember the award-winning photo of the starving child in Somalia who was dying as he tried to crawl to the aid station a few yards away-- with vultures waiting in the background of the photo?
The photographer was interviewed after he received the reward. The gist of the interviewers' questions were, "Did you move the child to the aid station...?" so he wouldn't starve or get attacked by vultures.
The photographer being interviewed never "got it." His answers focused only on what he had to do to compose the photo. "No," he said. He didn't need to move the child, because he was able to take the photo from just the right angle to get the pitiful starving child, vultures, and aid station all in the picture! Apparently, he took the picture of a starving child and walked away. It wouldn't surprise me if he sat down, ate a ham sandwich, and waited to see if the vultures would eat the kid.
So the only response of the media profession to this photographer's inhuman cruelty was to give the guy an award!
Posted by: WAT at June 15, 2004 11:18 AM (E51HU)
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